Post by ryan on Jul 13, 2008 14:35:33 GMT
I think it's clear that it'll stay, there's no real point discussing that. Personally, I don't dig it because it doesn't fit to my ears, perhaps just because of what we've heard from them in the past. It's kinda spat out in a way that doesn't fit the rest of the delivery of the rest of the song, or in the wider context of PRRs catalogue, as well.
On the subject of the word being used, surely Mr. murphymurphy (mr...? sorry if not) as a poetry lover you'd understand that a good writer is one who is able to very carefully select the words he needs in order to convey his point. So 'fuck' is as much a valid word as anything else in achieving this goal. I don't think anything quite captures the emotion of being really angry as uttering a solitary 'fuck'.
Take someone like Philip Larkin, he doesn't censor himself, or restrict himself to not swearing, because he needs those words to convey the way he's feeling. Perhaps it's also to do with helping the (and please forgive this as a phrase, but I hope you see my point) 'common man' understand where he's going, or perhaps (more likely) it's what he'd say in real life, why dress it up. I remember in and English Lit class we read one of his poems with the word 'c***' (I understand this word causes great offence, I wouldn't normally star it up but offending isn't my intention). The girls in the class (5 or 6 of them) right away pretty much refused to talk about the poem because he 'hated women' etc. etc. Me and my teacher were pretty dumbstruck, he was trying to lead a discussion (on poems that would crop up in exams) and was being shot down. It's a pretty derogatory poem granted, but they kinda missed the point. The fact is that word was most appropriate to the situation.
Taking your point against Rage Against The Machine, I think (and forgive me for sounding patronising, it's not the intention) it's clear that Zach de la Rocha uses that kind of language (a stupid phrase really, 'that kind of language' is English) because it's the easiest way to give a sense of the anger involved in what he's saying. He's a pretty angry man is Zach. And obviously just the sound of the word is angry, the hard K and that. RATM are a more intelligent band than you give credit for, and perhaps you've only heard 'Killing In The Name' which I'll grant is a fairly silly and reactionary song lyrically, particularly next to some of their others.
Perhaps that's the case with PRR and fuck-gate, the way it's kinda spat, and the hard constants highlight what Jons trying to get across, and perhaps I've argued myself into a corner that way! It just sounds out of place amongst his work to my ears, I don't think he's wrong to use it I just don't like it! I like the edit no more or less if I think about it really, it's as jarring having the edit in there. Don't see the point in censoring it but there you go.
Sorry that was so long, but there's just a snobbery about swearing I'm not down with. Obviously someone saying fuck every other word is stupid, but using them as an expression of emotion (in my opinion) is as valid as anything else.
On the subject of the word being used, surely Mr. murphymurphy (mr...? sorry if not) as a poetry lover you'd understand that a good writer is one who is able to very carefully select the words he needs in order to convey his point. So 'fuck' is as much a valid word as anything else in achieving this goal. I don't think anything quite captures the emotion of being really angry as uttering a solitary 'fuck'.
Take someone like Philip Larkin, he doesn't censor himself, or restrict himself to not swearing, because he needs those words to convey the way he's feeling. Perhaps it's also to do with helping the (and please forgive this as a phrase, but I hope you see my point) 'common man' understand where he's going, or perhaps (more likely) it's what he'd say in real life, why dress it up. I remember in and English Lit class we read one of his poems with the word 'c***' (I understand this word causes great offence, I wouldn't normally star it up but offending isn't my intention). The girls in the class (5 or 6 of them) right away pretty much refused to talk about the poem because he 'hated women' etc. etc. Me and my teacher were pretty dumbstruck, he was trying to lead a discussion (on poems that would crop up in exams) and was being shot down. It's a pretty derogatory poem granted, but they kinda missed the point. The fact is that word was most appropriate to the situation.
Taking your point against Rage Against The Machine, I think (and forgive me for sounding patronising, it's not the intention) it's clear that Zach de la Rocha uses that kind of language (a stupid phrase really, 'that kind of language' is English) because it's the easiest way to give a sense of the anger involved in what he's saying. He's a pretty angry man is Zach. And obviously just the sound of the word is angry, the hard K and that. RATM are a more intelligent band than you give credit for, and perhaps you've only heard 'Killing In The Name' which I'll grant is a fairly silly and reactionary song lyrically, particularly next to some of their others.
Perhaps that's the case with PRR and fuck-gate, the way it's kinda spat, and the hard constants highlight what Jons trying to get across, and perhaps I've argued myself into a corner that way! It just sounds out of place amongst his work to my ears, I don't think he's wrong to use it I just don't like it! I like the edit no more or less if I think about it really, it's as jarring having the edit in there. Don't see the point in censoring it but there you go.
Sorry that was so long, but there's just a snobbery about swearing I'm not down with. Obviously someone saying fuck every other word is stupid, but using them as an expression of emotion (in my opinion) is as valid as anything else.
